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| Mr Pillai: You wrote:- <<why do you spread false ideas about ved in your postings?>> I have provided references. Why I Am Not A Hindu? http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/ramendra_nath/hindu.html <<NOWHERE in the ved is it taught that there is higher and lower caste.. god almighty repeatedly tells us mankind is like one family>> And how does Ved define God. <<casteism or 'jati' is a false teaching invented by the hindu priests to get power>> Mr Pillai please take up this issue with Hindu priests and other Hindu religious organizations. Obviously, they need to be educated more than anyone else. This seems to be your belief not theirs. <<the different varnas are part of yourself, and they are part of society..>> This is the first time I'm hearing this explanation. Could you provide references to who has given this interpretation. Or is it yours. Why should the varnas be a part of society that DIFFERENTIATES people based on varnas. Anything that becomes a reason for discrimination is inhuman. <<If man is made in the image of the cosmic person from different parts of whose body the various castes emerged, then clearly each human being has an element of each caste in him.>> This still does not explain why one caste is better than the other. If every man has all the four 'castes/parts' in him then why would one part of man be inferior to the other. Logically this is not so. I don't treat my leg any better than my arm. But Hindu Dharma as we know of it today doesn't agree with you. <<Now an individual may have a predilection towards a certain kind of activity but that does not mean that he does not possess other traits in him at the sametime. In fact the ancient philosophy of samkhya proclaims that each individual has elements of three different kinds of qualities. In our modern times of universal education and the promise that machines will do many of the labour oriented tasks for society, the only rational slogan now, as in the past, is that each person is simultaneously a brahman, a kshatriya, a vaishya, and a shudra.>> Is this your interpretation or the commonly accepted interpretation in Hindusim. If it is the right belief then there should be no Brahmin at all. Why is it that Brahmins enjoy a high status in Hindu Dharma than others. Are you trying to say that a Brahmin has a 'predilection' for religious activities. What guarantees are there that his son will ALSO have the same predilection. Is the son of an engineer always an engineer. Is a son of an architect always an architect. Why should a son of Brahmin be a Brahmin? Why can't a son of a Shudra who has a religious inclination perform religious cermony in Hindu temples. If you're views are acceptable then many Shudras who are religious should be acting as priests. Why stop them? <<is that each person is simultaneously a brahman, a kshatriya, a vaishya, and a shudra>> You still can't get over the idea of differentiating people based on their varnas. Why can't a man be called 'all-rounder,' if you will. Why STRESS that he needs to be a Brahmin, Kshatriya, Vaishya and a Shudra. Well if every man is everything then why is it that Shudras can't sit with Brahmins and eat food together. Don't you think that you need to raise this issue with Hindu religious organizations. Why preach to us, why not preach to the people who need this preaching? <<the almighty has given us his guidance in the ved that we may perfect ourselves not only as individuals internalising the virtues of the four varnas but as a society and a nation.>> And who is this Almighty. "internalising the virtues of four varnas' - now this is interesting. Why even STRESS the four varnas. I don't think the Almighty would like people to stress such a discriminatory idea. Don't you think so. <<to properly understand this mantra we must remember the definition of a purush (whch can mean 'man' in one sense when 'pura' is the body>> And different parts of the body are superior or inferior to one another. Why would God/pura consider so. I don't understand. <<and the almighty god in another sense when 'pura' is this entire universe>> And different parts of the universe are superior or inferior to one another. Is that what the purusa wants. <<which has four aspects - body, mind, intellect and atma (or the antahkarana chatushtaya - chitta, buddhi etc).. then similarly the body has the divisions of the mouth or head (mukha), the arms (bahu), the abdomen and thighs (uru) and the feet (pada) which have the functions of intellectual thought and expression, work or activity, stability and service/motion..>> It still doesn't answer the BASIC question. Why should one part of the body be SUPERIOR or INFERIOR to the other. All you're trying to do is somehow justify the need for social stratification by stretching an analogy out of context. Besides being illiogical it is inhuman. Social stratification is definitely not acceptable. It is a part of the Hindu society as we know of it. When it is not acceptable to ordinary men and women why should it be acceptable to God. <<the complete removal of the great afflictions, ignorance, injustice, poverty and idleness, as well as the fulfilment of the wants of a society will depend on the willingness of its members to voluntarily become its organs..>> OK. If a Shudra VOLUNTEERS to become a Brahmin is that acceptable. Will you support a Shudra who VOLUNTEERS his services. Will you take him to Hindu temples and convince the Brahmin to sit besides him and let the Shudra distribute the prashad. <<then the individual's mouth will not be his mouth, but the mouth of his society;>> How much say do the Shudras have in the society? I'm not sure if we're talking about the same Hindu caste society. Either I'm out of touch with the times or it's you. <<his arms will not be his own but that of his society.. the same would go for the abdomen/thighs and feet.. each person merges in a larger form, making his society a social organisation likened to a human being.. each person is an integral part of a whole, while having the whole in himself ->> Now all you're trying to accomplish is SOMEHOW construct an analogy between the human body and social stratification. I don't see the comparison work here. Maybe its my understanding. Let's not stretch things out of context. It won't make it sound any more logical. <<how can he ever feel superior to another organ?>> Isn't that what a Shudra asks of a Brahmin. And what do the Brahmins have to say. I think I'll stop here. <<there is much more on this issue of varna vyavastha, but i will try to continue if i get a chance to access the forums sometime soon..>> Please spend some time educating people who need to be educated. Sikhism preaches total equality and rejects casteism besides most other Hindu rites, rituals and Hindu philosophical explanations. We are not the ones who support Hindu caste system. It is the Hindu community that does. Your presence is welcome here. However, it is needed elsewhere. Thank you for taking the time to respond to the post. I appreciate your input. I hope you can convince your brothers and sisters in faith to end caste demarcations within the Hindu society. That would be the true service. Regards ********************** In solidarity Novelist Arundhati Roy expresses solidarity with the cause of Dalits and Dalit literature. http://www.the-hindu.com/fline/fl1603/16030810.htm R. MADHAVAN NAIR in Kozhikode ON a visit to Kerala, where The God of Small Things is set, its Booker Prize-winning author Arundhati Roy last fortnight eloquently expressed solidarity with "the Dalit struggle for justice and equality in a society wracked by caste prejudice" and made a significant, and widely appreciated, contribution to the cause of Dalit literature. Speaking at a reception organised in her honour in Kozhikode in her home State on January 15 by the Kerala Dalit Sahitya Akademi, Arundhati Roy, whose best-selling novel narrates poignantly a tragic tale of forbidden love involving an "untouchable", said that in her opinion the Dalit struggle for justice and equality would be, "and indeed ought to be", the biggest challenge that India would face in the next century. "I am fully aware," she observed, "that this particular war will be an immense and complicated one. That it will be waged in all sorts of ways, by all sorts of people in all sorts of places." And in a forthright expression of her solidarity with the Dalit cause, Arundhati Roy added: "I'm here to enlist." The novelist, who has spoken out powerfully against the Indian Government's May 1998 nuclear explosions and attempted nuclear weaponisation in her essay, "The End of Imagination", then proceeded to make a generous contribution to the cause of Dalit literature by offering "a part of the most precious thing that I possess" to the Dalit Sahitya Akademi. She invited the Akademi to publish the Malayalam translation of her novel (in association with D.C. Books, the Kerala-based publishers) and use the royalties therefrom to promote Dalit literature. Making clear the fact that hers was not a patronising or a charitable act, Arundhati Roy declared: "This is not a gift. It is an invitation to enter into a working contract with me. I hope you will publish it, sell it and use the royalties from the Malayalam book to help Dalit writers to tell their stories to the world." The fount of Arundhati Roy's significant act of literary solidarity was also made clear. "I give you my book in memory of Velutha," she concluded, alluding to the "untouchable" protagonist of the novel, The God of Small Things. THE Akademi's response to Arundhati Roy's expression of solidarity with the Dalit cause was characterised by much warmth. Her speech, delivered in Malayalam, drew loud and repeated applause. A spokesman for the Akademi said: "Her deep-seated sympathies for Dalits are evident in her novel." He then opened a copy of The God of Small Things and read out: "Who's Velutha?", Sophie Mol wanted to know. "A man we love," Rahel said. The Dalit perception of the socio-cultural significance of Arundhati Roy was explained in a paper presented by T.B. Vijaya Kumar, a Dalit activist, at a seminar organised by the Akademi on January 16 on the topic of "savarna sahithyam" (literature of the upper castes). The paper spoke of Arundhati Roy as "the brave daughter of the Sunnahados" and went on to explain why. The 400th anniversary of the 1599 Udayamperoor Sunnahados (a synod at Udayamperoor, Kerala) is being celebrated by Dalit groups; the Akademi considers the Sunnahados as an event that marked the starting point of an anti-caste movement within the Church in India. According to Vijaya Kumar's paper, it was organised by Portuguese-Goan Archbishop (Alexis Dom) Menezes to purge Syrian Christians in Kerala of their Hindu values and to make them "real Christians". He said that before the arrival of the Portuguese, Syrian Christians were believed to have followed, like upper-caste Hindus, a caste system and norms of untouchability, and also allegedly resorting to oppression of the lower castes. The Akademi considers Archbishop Menezes' efforts as revolutionary since among other things he opposed untouchability and wanted equal rights on family property to be granted to women. But, according to the paper, the Archbishop did not get very far with his ideas; the 1653 "koonankurisu sathyam" (an oath taken at koonankurisu at Mattancherry against Western domination of the church) put an end to the trend. The Protestant missionaries of the Church Missionary Society (CMS) and the London Mission Society (LMS) which were active in Kerala during a later period initiated social movements which led to a renaissance in thinking. This was followed by the emergence of social reformers such as Sri Narayana Guru and Ayyankali, and historic figures belonging to the the Left movement. Arundhati Roy was hailed by the Akademi as a person who, unlike others sharing her origins, had been totally purged of Hindu values. One speaker made a comparative study between Arundhati Roy and Shashi Tharoor, author of The Great Indian Novel, The Five Dollar Smile and Other Stories and India from Midnight to the Millennium, who too hails from Kerala. Arundhati Roy's empathy for Dalits, as manifested in the young twins' interactions with Velutha, came in for particular mention. Tharoor, by contrast, was presented in unfavourable light. IN declaring her full support for the Dalit struggle against centuries-old oppression, Arundhati Roy seems to have made a positive impression in Kerala's literary circles, even among those who do not fully subscribe to the Dalit Sahitya Akademi's world-view. Writer Thikkodiyan, who is Chairman of the Kerala Sangeetha Nataka Akademi, said: "I am happy that she has identified herself with a cause. It has to be seen as a sincere gesture since she already has the fame and the money ... But the Dalit Akademi's activists sometimes have strange views which are not always based on facts." Dr. Punathil Kunhabdulla, Malayalam novelist, and Dr. M.M. Basheer, literary critic, observed that Arundhati Roy's gesture in inviting the Akademi to become involved in the publication of the Malayalam edition of her novel and offering it the royalties therefrom had given a big boost to Dalit literature, even though, in their opinion, it was difficult to agree with all of the Akademi's views and activities. Punathil Kunhabdulla was all praise for the Akademi for its having organised the reception for Arundhati Roy. Basheer said that in his view, the success of the Malayalam edition would depend on the quality of translation. He attributed the popularity of the English edition in Kerala mainly to the quality of the writing. The God of Small Things is, of course, not the first novel by a writer from Kerala to explore the social condition of Dalits. Dalits rate Kadammanitta Ramakrishnan's Kurathi, Valsala's Nellu, Kumaran Asan's Duravastha and K.J. Baby's Maveli Manram as classics in Dalit literature; their authors, significantly, are not Dalits. Basheer rates Kocharayathi, a novel by Dalit writer Narayan, as one of the outstanding Malayalam novels published in 1998. The Kerala Dalit Sahitya Akademi holds the opinion that the literary and cultural atmosphere in Kerala is hostile to Dalits; however, a big volume of Dalit literature exists in Malayalam. A good example is offered by the recent issues of the literary magazine Kerala Kavitha which feature Malayalam translations of Dalit writings in Marathi and Oriya. All things considered, Arundhati Roy's visit gave a big boost to the Akademi, which is known to hold radical views on socio-cultural issues. The meeting was attended by large numbers of book-lovers ranging from college students to seasoned writers and literary critics: some came to listen to her, some for her autographs and some for a glimpse of that face made familiar by the media. ARUNDHATI ROY had one other engagement in Kozhikode - an autograph-signing session organised by D.C. Books; the author autographed scores of copies of her novel and her essay "The End of Imagination" (originally published in Frontline, August 14, 1998, and Outlook and issued as a book by D.C. Books, with the royalties going to the Campaign Against Nuclear Weapons in India). But her undivided attention was reserved for the Akademi reception. She declined invitations to other functions in Kozhikode. (After the programme, on her way back from the city by road, she spent some time in Vazhakkad village on the banks of the Chaliyar, which has a high incidence of cancer, an incidence that is often linked to effluents from the wood pulp factory of Grasim Industries at nearby Mavoor.) By announcing her support for the Dalit cause, Arundhati Roy has taken a decisive step. She remains primarily a literary figure of international distinction, but a literary figure who has stepped out in the public arena to speak forthrightly and powerfully on just causes she has chosen for herself. ************************* |
