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Summary of Question:	Waho Waho Gobind Singh Aape Gur Chela
Category:	General Sikhism
Date Posted:	Tuesday, 4/30/2002 7:10 AM MDT

WJKK, WJKF

I am a baptised sikh born and living in UK. My parent came to England via Kenya in 1958. I was baptised in 1975 when I was 9 years old. I have since tried to follow the maryada to my best ability. That includes NOT eating meat, eggs, drinking alchohol etc.....and have managed to survive and educate others under these so called western influences. Infact my English friends and colleagues actually appreciate my beliefs and try to change their own lives to fit around me to some extent.

I have done extensive research on sikhi and the creation of the Khalsa and have discussed this question with many scholars, who have been unable to give me a satifactory answer with proof.

I belive that Guru ji made the amrit and created the panj piare. I also believe that he drank amrit him self making him his own chela. and not the khalsas chela. i.e. he did not take the amrit from the panj piare.

I have seen no proof contradicting this thought to date. Every thing has been from the writings by santokh singh etc.. who himself writes don't beleive everything I write - as these books were compiled under hindu influences. Judge everything based on the teachings of the Guru sahib...

As we all know only once you take amrit - you have only entered the school of sikhi and this doesn't automatically qualify you as a khalsa or sikh - and you have to go through years of challenges to pass your final exams! and hopefully graduate as a Khalsa. again you may be graded according to your ability/devotion.

I hope you can see what I trying to say??

I have seen sikhnets views on this subject before. Again they gave me no reason to change my views.

I don't realy know if I'm looking for a reply, but I would appreciate some feedback.

Regards

Harminder Singh
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Reply
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Greetings and blessings to you innthe Name of God the Light of every soul and in the Name of Guru the life of every Sikh.

Harminder Singh ji, your heart is definitely in the right place. However, your head is getting in the way of the power of "Shabd Guru".

Here is a little formula for you:
1.Guru Gobind Rai + the "Shabd Guru" and all the human elements;wife and patasis, human need of the times, 5 men with willingness to surrender their ego's...created the Punj Piare.

2.Guru Gobind Rai + the "Sahbd Guru" + Punj Piare + Amrit created "Guru Gobind Singh"

3.Guru Gobind Singh gave the Guruship to the "Shabd Guru" as well as the "Sadh Sangat".

4. We are "Khalsa" "pure ones" when we use the Shabd Guru. We have this opportunity every moment and every day of our life. The Rehit Maryada is the Shabd Guru in action.

5. Ther is no limit to the power of the Siri Guru Granth Sahib to transform each one of us to win the spirit over the mind. We have this task every breath.

In conclusion you can experience this transformation of yourself plus the Guru in your daily practice so that you are "jinee Naam di-aa-yaa....." "after doing this hard work of meditation, shining is your face and your radiance works to uplife many others". The times do not require debate and words as much as the many Lights or channels of consiousness that can bring our life peaceful experience. This is the power of the mastery of the Guru/who was also chela to the "Shabd Guru".